Trim Tabs or Hydrofoils for 170 BASS?

[dkaraluz]

I bought a 170 DC new back in October 2006 and after the third trip I installed a hydrofoil: yes, I didn't like drilling holes in my brand new motor but what a difference! Believe me, you will not recognize the boat: from a slow dog it became an eager planner!
http://www.performanceoutdoors.net/forums/album.php?albumid=567&attachmentid=5767

 

[JETPILOT]

I have 170 dc.
I use a hydrafoil.
Easy to fit.
Faster planing and better turning at speed, more stable.

 

[Troll]

Triumph should take notice!

By now there have been over 800 viewers of this thread that I started and over 20 comments. All comments have said that either hydro-foils or trim tabs make a big improvement in the handling of their Triumph boat. When a boat handles better, it is also safer.

I think it is now time for Triumph to take action and install some form of stabilization on their boats at the factory. At the least, they should recommend that all buyers have their dealer install either trim tabs (either electrically controlled or automatic) or a hydrofoil.

Don't you wish that you had had this advise with your made the purchase of your Triumph?

Troll

 

[NCangler]

Troll, Trim tabs and a hydrofoil are an option. If I'm buying a boat and choose to add them to my boat order and negotiate it with the dealer that is fine. I don't see how you can demand that a boat manufacturer provide them as standard equipment. The boats handle fine without Trim Tabs, but many have reported that they like the handling better after adding trim tabs. So they are available as an option. That seems good enough to me.

 

[Troll]

NCangler,

I beg to differ with you about how the Triumph boats handle without trim tabs or hydrofoils. My 170 Bass from the factory was equipeed with a 4S Suzuki 70 hp. 90% of the time, it would not get on plane without someone walking forward while under excelleration. If I was alone I had to hold on to the steering wheel and walk as forward as possilbe. This is dangerous. So is driving a boat with the bow up in the air so visability is impared.

I am merely suggesting that Triumph post a notice on the boat or in the literature that trim tabs or hydrofoils will not only improve handling, but make for a better boating experience. I wish that I had had such a notice at the time of my purchase. It was only after complaining that my dealer suggested trim tabs, and then he did not now if they would help that much.

If your Triumph gets on plane without assistance and without having to go a half mile with the bow in the air. That is great. All I know is what my boat did before I installed trim tabs. I also have two different props so that WOT is in the range specified by Suzuki.

Troll

 

[fridaysoff]

Troll,
I had a 2004 170CC with a 60HP 4 stroke Yamaha. My boat would get on plane fine without moving to the bow. If the motor is trimmed all the way down and you put the trottle all the way forward I cannot imagine why your boat/motor will not get on plane unless its overloaded with people,gear,etc. I'm like NC Angler, trim tabs or hydrofoils are and should be an option. When I see a "whaletail" on an outboard motor the first thing I think is its an underpowered boat. Just my 2 cents!!
John D.

 

[cagrove]

I don't have trim tabs or a hydrofoil and my boat runs great...up on plane quickly...doesn't wander at slow speeds...runs level...everything that I expect it to do. I also have a two-stroke 60 hp Mercury on the back. I guess it all depends on how you set your boat up as to the performance you get out of it. That's not a manufacturer issue, that's a dealer/buyer issue. Put a heavy engine on the rear and you need to compensate for it. Just my 1/50th of a dollar.

 

[tupperware]

I have a 170 cc with dealer installed "dolphin" , it helps the boat plane . I think they were $65 .

tupperware

 

[tupperware]

Check my New boat pics you see can them , they are black and just above the prop.

 

[tfink]

Nice pics Tupperware.

 

[Steve762us]

Sounds like hydrofoils or tabs will help out...I'm a newb to outboard propulsion, so I'm listening to everyone.

One point that the "tab school" makes is that the tabs provide lift from two points, at the outer edges of the transom---vs. the hydrofoil, that provides lift from the motor (single central lift point). The tab folks say this provides a less stable lift.

What do you folks think?

 

[SWAMPTHANG]

I have the Naticus trim tabs on my 170cc and a SE-sport 300 hydrofoil. The trim tabs were on the boat when I bought it. I added the hydrofoil after noticing the boat seemed to skip when making sharp turns at speed. I had adjusted the trim tabs before I installed the hydrofoil and improved it's handling but, could not get the stable feeling I was looking for in the turns. I should note that my last boat was a 16' bass boat with a 135 Evinrude you could make a 50+ mph turn with it without slowing down. The two boats are totally different on the way they are designed and handle. The hydrofoil with the trim tabs seem to be a great combination as I can now take a turn close to full speed without having to play with my trim as much. I am quite pleased with the results. We use our boat for tubing and for fishing so, the extra stability has given me peace of mind. We live on the Northeast Cape Fear River where there are a lot of tight turns with no room for chine walk. I look at the adding of the trim tabs and hydrofoil as compared to tweaking your car or truck with after market parts. You add the parts to improve on handling, power or cosmetic reasons. The add ons to my boat have not only improved it's handling but, also it's fuel range. We can tube for a solid 3-3.5 hrs and only burn 5 gals of fuel. That is extremely impressive to me. My last boat would have burned 18-20 gals doing the same thing. The outboard I currently have is the DF-70 Suzuki 4 stroke with ss prop. This is by far my favorite boat as I can play all day, fish in the shallows, fish offshore without spending a fortune in fuel and do it all from the same boat. No complaints here!!!

 

[Troll]

Trim Tabs are good, but not perfect!

I started this thread some time ago and have now had considerable time on my 170 bass with the Nautacus Trim Tabs.

When I am on a lake at an elevation under 1,000 feet, and use my 17 pitch prop, I have no problem getting up to plane in quick order. Handling is great, but when trolling, there is still a little wondering from left to right and right to left. At this elevation I can have a full tank of gas and a full live well and passengers.

When I am at my usual lake that is at 5,300 feet elevation, it is a different story. At this elevation I switch the prop to a 15 pitch. If I have a full tank of gas and or the live well full of water, getting on plane can still be a bit of a problem. Usually if there are only two of us in the boat, we can make it to plane, but it does take about 100 yards. With a third passenger, it probalby won't get on plane without someone walking forward. However, once on plane at this elevation, it performs well.

Before the trim tabs, I used to drive it WOT to keep it on plane. Now, I drive it at about 4,500 rpm with almost the same speed, but with big gas savings. My motor is a 4S Suzuki 70 hp.

While the 4 stoke engines offer great fuel economy compared to most 2 strokes, they don't seem to have the same start up torque and they are usually heavier when compared to the same horse power 2S engines.

I like the idea of installing both trim tabs and a hydrofoil to the motor, but I have elected not to drill holes in my motor.

All in all, I am still pleased with the Nauticus Trim Tabs, but I would like to know if the Nauticus Trim Tabs for the next size of boat would better fit my needs.

 

[SWAMPTHANG]

You may need to talk to your Suzuki dealer about running in the higher elevation. The higher elevation causes engines to usually run a lot leaner. I would talk with a Suzuki tech. to see if anything needs to be adjusted or swapped out for running at the higher elevation. You may not be getting all the fuel you need to create efficient power. Most efi's have corrected this problem since they are computer controlled but, I have heard of cases where the controller had to be swapped out to deliver the extra fuel the engine needed for running at higher elevations. I would check with Suzuki to see if this could be the case also, how high or low is your engine mounted to your transom? I believe mine is mounted on the top hole. I hope this helps I know how frustating it can be to have your toys not perform the way you expect them to.

 

[HIGH&DRY]

Altitude performance.
At high elevations our engines are getting less air, so they need less fuel to maintain the proper air/fuel ratio. Often with a carburetor gas engine you would go down main jet size for every 1750 to 2000 feet of elevation you go up .
Generally high elevation gasoline is less dense to compensate for less available air going into the engine and to aid starting.
Cold air is dense air and dense air requires bigger jets, but this would be very much colder air than most boaters would be comfortable in.
Generally you figure about 3% power loss for every 1000 foot gain in altitude with a gasoline engine!
Diesel engines may be poorer performers, that is why turbo is popular at high altitude!
Sea level is good for very many reasons!
HIGH&DRY

 

[Troll]

High elevation performance

I agree that a 70 HP engine will have about 60 HP at 5,000 feet elevation. To compensate, I switch to a 15 pitch prop, as opposed to the 17 pitch and at WOT I do get my desired max RPM's of 5400. I did check with my dealer and he told me that the Suzuki 4S 70 HP motor had an automatic fuel compensation for altitude. It was his suggestion that I also use a lower pitch prop at higher elevations.

The 170 bass is no longer in production. However, if you put 4 storage compartments (one with the battery) behind the driver and passenger along with a 20 gal fuel tank and a 10 - 15 gal live well, there is a lot of weight at the rear of the boat. I also have a 4 HP kicker motor and that must add another 40 pounds or so.

All in all, there is a lot of weight the rear half of the this boat, with virtually none in the front half. This causes the bow to just naturally rise. Look at the picture of me in the boat before the kicker motor was installed and with no water in the live well.

Perhaps this design is the reason that Triumph quit making the 170 bass.

 

[Troll]

There are several holes on the Nauticus Trim Tab where the gas filled cartridge connects. I started with the Nauticus factory recommendation, but recently increased the pressure by changing which hole was used for the connection. This did help my problem of getting up on plane at 5000 feet elevation.